I'm completing a wavefront object parser and I want to use it to construct generic mesh objects. My engine uses OpenGL 4 and shaders to draw everything in my engine.
My question is about how to ensure best rendering efficiency for rendering a mesh.
A wavefront .obj file normally has many object sub-groups specified.
A sub-group might be assigned a specific material (e.g. a shiny red colour).
So a mesh might be a fairly complex collection of sub-groups, each with their own material assigned.
My questions are -
Q. Do I need to draw each sub-group separately e.g. with a call to glDrawElements for each sub-group ? (So if I had 4 separate sub-groups, I'd have to make four glDrawElements calls, thereby invoking the shader 4 times with 4 uniform changes (for the materials/textures) )
glDrawElements( GL_TRIANGLES, nNumIndicesInGroup, GL_UNSIGNED_INT, ((char*)NULL)+ first-vertex-offset );
If this is correct, then I'll have to calculate:
The indices in each sub-group (implying a separate index array and VAO for each sub-group)
The vertex offset of the start of the sub-group
This seems terribly inefficient, am I barking up the wrong tree?
Also, from the Wavefront obj wiki page:
Smooth shading across polygons is enabled by smoothing groups.
s 1
...
# Smooth shading can be disabled as well.
s off
...
Can anyone suggest what smooth shading values indicate? E.g. s1, s2, s4 etc.
Yes, you should draw each sub-group separately from the others. This is required till the state is different between sub-groups.
But you are making a too long step.
To avoid multiple draw calls, you can introduce a vertex attribute indicating an index used for accessing uniform array values (array of materials, array of textures). In this way, you need only one draw call, but you will have the cost of one additional attribute and its relative management.
I would avoid the above approach. What if a sub-group is textured and another one not? How do you discriminate whether to texture or not? Introducing other attributes? Seems confusing.
The first point is that the buffer object management is very flexible. Indeed you could have a single element buffer object and a single vertex buffer object: using offsets and interleaving you can satisfy every level of complexity. And then, on modern harware, using vertex array objects you can minimize the cost of the different buffer bindings.
Second point is that your software can group different sub-group having the same uniform state, joining multiple draw calls into a single one. Remember that you can use Multi draw entry points variants, and there's also the primitive restart that can aid you (in the case stripped primitives).
Other considerations are not usefull, because you have to draw anyway, regardless if it's complex or not. Successively, when you have a correct rendering, you could profile the application and the rendering, cutting-off the hot-spots.
Smoothing groups are a collection of vertices that are sharing the same option attribute (normals, texture coordinates). This is the case of element-indexed vertices.
To go deeper on subject, read one of the specification found by googling.
Related
I have some vertex data. Positions, normals, texture coordinates. I probably loaded it from a .obj file or some other format. Maybe I'm drawing a cube. But each piece of vertex data has its own index. Can I render this mesh data using OpenGL/Direct3D?
In the most general sense, no. OpenGL and Direct3D only allow one index per vertex; the index fetches from each stream of vertex data. Therefore, every unique combination of components must have its own separate index.
So if you have a cube, where each face has its own normal, you will need to replicate the position and normal data a lot. You will need 24 positions and 24 normals, even though the cube will only have 8 unique positions and 6 unique normals.
Your best bet is to simply accept that your data will be larger. A great many model formats will use multiple indices; you will need to fixup this vertex data before you can render with it. Many mesh loading tools, such as Open Asset Importer, will perform this fixup for you.
It should also be noted that most meshes are not cubes. Most meshes are smooth across the vast majority of vertices, only occasionally having different normals/texture coordinates/etc. So while this often comes up for simple geometric shapes, real models rarely have substantial amounts of vertex duplication.
GL 3.x and D3D10
For D3D10/OpenGL 3.x-class hardware, it is possible to avoid performing fixup and use multiple indexed attributes directly. However, be advised that this will likely decrease rendering performance.
The following discussion will use the OpenGL terminology, but Direct3D v10 and above has equivalent functionality.
The idea is to manually access the different vertex attributes from the vertex shader. Instead of sending the vertex attributes directly, the attributes that are passed are actually the indices for that particular vertex. The vertex shader then uses the indices to access the actual attribute through one or more buffer textures.
Attributes can be stored in multiple buffer textures or all within one. If the latter is used, then the shader will need an offset to add to each index in order to find the corresponding attribute's start index in the buffer.
Regular vertex attributes can be compressed in many ways. Buffer textures have fewer means of compression, allowing only a relatively limited number of vertex formats (via the image formats they support).
Please note again that any of these techniques may decrease overall vertex processing performance. Therefore, it should only be used in the most memory-limited of circumstances, after all other options for compression or optimization have been exhausted.
OpenGL ES 3.0 provides buffer textures as well. Higher OpenGL versions allow you to read buffer objects more directly via SSBOs rather than buffer textures, which might have better performance characteristics.
I found a way that allows you to reduce this sort of repetition that runs a bit contrary to some of the statements made in the other answer (but doesn't specifically fit the question asked here). It does however address my question which was thought to be a repeat of this question.
I just learned about Interpolation qualifiers. Specifically "flat". It's my understanding that putting the flat qualifier on your vertex shader output causes only the provoking vertex to pass it's values to the fragment shader.
This means for the situation described in this quote:
So if you have a cube, where each face has its own normal, you will need to replicate the position and normal data a lot. You will need 24 positions and 24 normals, even though the cube will only have 8 unique positions and 6 unique normals.
You can have 8 vertexes, 6 of which contain the unique normals and 2 of normal values are disregarded, so long as you carefully order your primitives indices such that the "provoking vertex" contains the normal data you want to apply to the entire face.
EDIT: My understanding of how it works:
I have some vertex data. Positions, normals, texture coordinates. I probably loaded it from a .obj file or some other format. Maybe I'm drawing a cube. But each piece of vertex data has its own index. Can I render this mesh data using OpenGL/Direct3D?
In the most general sense, no. OpenGL and Direct3D only allow one index per vertex; the index fetches from each stream of vertex data. Therefore, every unique combination of components must have its own separate index.
So if you have a cube, where each face has its own normal, you will need to replicate the position and normal data a lot. You will need 24 positions and 24 normals, even though the cube will only have 8 unique positions and 6 unique normals.
Your best bet is to simply accept that your data will be larger. A great many model formats will use multiple indices; you will need to fixup this vertex data before you can render with it. Many mesh loading tools, such as Open Asset Importer, will perform this fixup for you.
It should also be noted that most meshes are not cubes. Most meshes are smooth across the vast majority of vertices, only occasionally having different normals/texture coordinates/etc. So while this often comes up for simple geometric shapes, real models rarely have substantial amounts of vertex duplication.
GL 3.x and D3D10
For D3D10/OpenGL 3.x-class hardware, it is possible to avoid performing fixup and use multiple indexed attributes directly. However, be advised that this will likely decrease rendering performance.
The following discussion will use the OpenGL terminology, but Direct3D v10 and above has equivalent functionality.
The idea is to manually access the different vertex attributes from the vertex shader. Instead of sending the vertex attributes directly, the attributes that are passed are actually the indices for that particular vertex. The vertex shader then uses the indices to access the actual attribute through one or more buffer textures.
Attributes can be stored in multiple buffer textures or all within one. If the latter is used, then the shader will need an offset to add to each index in order to find the corresponding attribute's start index in the buffer.
Regular vertex attributes can be compressed in many ways. Buffer textures have fewer means of compression, allowing only a relatively limited number of vertex formats (via the image formats they support).
Please note again that any of these techniques may decrease overall vertex processing performance. Therefore, it should only be used in the most memory-limited of circumstances, after all other options for compression or optimization have been exhausted.
OpenGL ES 3.0 provides buffer textures as well. Higher OpenGL versions allow you to read buffer objects more directly via SSBOs rather than buffer textures, which might have better performance characteristics.
I found a way that allows you to reduce this sort of repetition that runs a bit contrary to some of the statements made in the other answer (but doesn't specifically fit the question asked here). It does however address my question which was thought to be a repeat of this question.
I just learned about Interpolation qualifiers. Specifically "flat". It's my understanding that putting the flat qualifier on your vertex shader output causes only the provoking vertex to pass it's values to the fragment shader.
This means for the situation described in this quote:
So if you have a cube, where each face has its own normal, you will need to replicate the position and normal data a lot. You will need 24 positions and 24 normals, even though the cube will only have 8 unique positions and 6 unique normals.
You can have 8 vertexes, 6 of which contain the unique normals and 2 of normal values are disregarded, so long as you carefully order your primitives indices such that the "provoking vertex" contains the normal data you want to apply to the entire face.
EDIT: My understanding of how it works:
I have some vertex data. Positions, normals, texture coordinates. I probably loaded it from a .obj file or some other format. Maybe I'm drawing a cube. But each piece of vertex data has its own index. Can I render this mesh data using OpenGL/Direct3D?
In the most general sense, no. OpenGL and Direct3D only allow one index per vertex; the index fetches from each stream of vertex data. Therefore, every unique combination of components must have its own separate index.
So if you have a cube, where each face has its own normal, you will need to replicate the position and normal data a lot. You will need 24 positions and 24 normals, even though the cube will only have 8 unique positions and 6 unique normals.
Your best bet is to simply accept that your data will be larger. A great many model formats will use multiple indices; you will need to fixup this vertex data before you can render with it. Many mesh loading tools, such as Open Asset Importer, will perform this fixup for you.
It should also be noted that most meshes are not cubes. Most meshes are smooth across the vast majority of vertices, only occasionally having different normals/texture coordinates/etc. So while this often comes up for simple geometric shapes, real models rarely have substantial amounts of vertex duplication.
GL 3.x and D3D10
For D3D10/OpenGL 3.x-class hardware, it is possible to avoid performing fixup and use multiple indexed attributes directly. However, be advised that this will likely decrease rendering performance.
The following discussion will use the OpenGL terminology, but Direct3D v10 and above has equivalent functionality.
The idea is to manually access the different vertex attributes from the vertex shader. Instead of sending the vertex attributes directly, the attributes that are passed are actually the indices for that particular vertex. The vertex shader then uses the indices to access the actual attribute through one or more buffer textures.
Attributes can be stored in multiple buffer textures or all within one. If the latter is used, then the shader will need an offset to add to each index in order to find the corresponding attribute's start index in the buffer.
Regular vertex attributes can be compressed in many ways. Buffer textures have fewer means of compression, allowing only a relatively limited number of vertex formats (via the image formats they support).
Please note again that any of these techniques may decrease overall vertex processing performance. Therefore, it should only be used in the most memory-limited of circumstances, after all other options for compression or optimization have been exhausted.
OpenGL ES 3.0 provides buffer textures as well. Higher OpenGL versions allow you to read buffer objects more directly via SSBOs rather than buffer textures, which might have better performance characteristics.
I found a way that allows you to reduce this sort of repetition that runs a bit contrary to some of the statements made in the other answer (but doesn't specifically fit the question asked here). It does however address my question which was thought to be a repeat of this question.
I just learned about Interpolation qualifiers. Specifically "flat". It's my understanding that putting the flat qualifier on your vertex shader output causes only the provoking vertex to pass it's values to the fragment shader.
This means for the situation described in this quote:
So if you have a cube, where each face has its own normal, you will need to replicate the position and normal data a lot. You will need 24 positions and 24 normals, even though the cube will only have 8 unique positions and 6 unique normals.
You can have 8 vertexes, 6 of which contain the unique normals and 2 of normal values are disregarded, so long as you carefully order your primitives indices such that the "provoking vertex" contains the normal data you want to apply to the entire face.
EDIT: My understanding of how it works:
For the latest Ludum Dare competition the theme was shapeshifting, so my idea involved simple morphing from one geometric shape to another.
So what I did was I made a few objects in Blender with the same vertex count. In OpenGL I made separate VAOs for each object and one additional VAO (with dynamic draw attributes) for the "morphing" object. Every frame, while the player is shapeshifting, I would upload interpolated vertex data, between the current object and the target object, into this extra VAO and then render. Otherwise just render the object's corresponding VAO.
Morphing looked like this:
(The vertices have a different ordering, so morphing is not "smooth")
Since I had little time I just made something quick and dirty but now I think this is not a great way of doing this process, because I have to upload a lot of data to the GPU every frame. And it doesn't look scalable either, if I ever wanted to draw multiple morphing objects at different morphing stages.
As a first step to improve this process I would like to move those interpolation calcs into the shaders.
I could perhaps store the data for all objects in a single VAO, in separate attributes, and then select which of the attributes to interpolate from.
But I was wondering: is there a way to somehow send multiple (two) objects/buffers into the shaders, along with an interpolation rate uniform, and then in the shaders I would do the interpolation?
You can create a buffer that holds several coordinates for each vertex. Just like normally you have coordinates, normals, texture coordinates you can have coordinate1, coordinate2, coordinate3 etc. Then in the shader you can have a uniform variable that says which to use.
With two it's of course easy since the uniform will be from zero to one and you just multiply the first coordinate with it and add the second multiplied with (1.0 - value).
Then just make sure you create the meshes from the same base shape and they will morph nicely.
Also if you use normals, make sure you have several normals and interpolate between them also.
The minus in this is that the more data you put through the more skipping in memory the shader has to do so it might not be the prettiest solution if you have a lot of forms.
I have some vertex data. Positions, normals, texture coordinates. I probably loaded it from a .obj file or some other format. Maybe I'm drawing a cube. But each piece of vertex data has its own index. Can I render this mesh data using OpenGL/Direct3D?
In the most general sense, no. OpenGL and Direct3D only allow one index per vertex; the index fetches from each stream of vertex data. Therefore, every unique combination of components must have its own separate index.
So if you have a cube, where each face has its own normal, you will need to replicate the position and normal data a lot. You will need 24 positions and 24 normals, even though the cube will only have 8 unique positions and 6 unique normals.
Your best bet is to simply accept that your data will be larger. A great many model formats will use multiple indices; you will need to fixup this vertex data before you can render with it. Many mesh loading tools, such as Open Asset Importer, will perform this fixup for you.
It should also be noted that most meshes are not cubes. Most meshes are smooth across the vast majority of vertices, only occasionally having different normals/texture coordinates/etc. So while this often comes up for simple geometric shapes, real models rarely have substantial amounts of vertex duplication.
GL 3.x and D3D10
For D3D10/OpenGL 3.x-class hardware, it is possible to avoid performing fixup and use multiple indexed attributes directly. However, be advised that this will likely decrease rendering performance.
The following discussion will use the OpenGL terminology, but Direct3D v10 and above has equivalent functionality.
The idea is to manually access the different vertex attributes from the vertex shader. Instead of sending the vertex attributes directly, the attributes that are passed are actually the indices for that particular vertex. The vertex shader then uses the indices to access the actual attribute through one or more buffer textures.
Attributes can be stored in multiple buffer textures or all within one. If the latter is used, then the shader will need an offset to add to each index in order to find the corresponding attribute's start index in the buffer.
Regular vertex attributes can be compressed in many ways. Buffer textures have fewer means of compression, allowing only a relatively limited number of vertex formats (via the image formats they support).
Please note again that any of these techniques may decrease overall vertex processing performance. Therefore, it should only be used in the most memory-limited of circumstances, after all other options for compression or optimization have been exhausted.
OpenGL ES 3.0 provides buffer textures as well. Higher OpenGL versions allow you to read buffer objects more directly via SSBOs rather than buffer textures, which might have better performance characteristics.
I found a way that allows you to reduce this sort of repetition that runs a bit contrary to some of the statements made in the other answer (but doesn't specifically fit the question asked here). It does however address my question which was thought to be a repeat of this question.
I just learned about Interpolation qualifiers. Specifically "flat". It's my understanding that putting the flat qualifier on your vertex shader output causes only the provoking vertex to pass it's values to the fragment shader.
This means for the situation described in this quote:
So if you have a cube, where each face has its own normal, you will need to replicate the position and normal data a lot. You will need 24 positions and 24 normals, even though the cube will only have 8 unique positions and 6 unique normals.
You can have 8 vertexes, 6 of which contain the unique normals and 2 of normal values are disregarded, so long as you carefully order your primitives indices such that the "provoking vertex" contains the normal data you want to apply to the entire face.
EDIT: My understanding of how it works: