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I am about to start a new project and would like to document its development in a very simple blog.
My requirements are:
self-hosted on my Gentoo-based LAMP stack (that seems to rule out blogger)
Integration in a django based website (as in www.myproject.com/about, www.myproject.com/blog etc rather than www.myproject.com and a totally different site at blog.myproject.com)
very little or no learning curve that's specific to the blog engine (don't want to learn an API just to blog, but having to get deeper into Django to be able to roll my own would be OK) According to the answers so far, there is a chance that this excludes Wordpress
Should I
a) install blog engine X (please specify X)
b) use django to hand-roll a way to post new entries and a page on my website to display the posts in descending chronological order
Install Wordpress. It is the most common engine for a reason. It's PHP but will play just fine in your environment.
If you're the perfectionist kind, roll your own.
It isn't that hard
You learn something useful
You'll get exactly what you want and need
Be warned that you may run into a quagmire fighting comment spam, fixing security holes, etc. But it'll probably be a fun project.
If you are the practical type and ready to face some integration pain, use an existing engine like WadcomBlog (Python) or PyBlosxom, or something completely different like MovableType or WordPress.
Here's a simple Django blog example to get you started.
Some pros and cons of rolling your blog engine this article by Phil Haack.
Jeff Croft apparently rolled his own as well.
I've tried WordPress recently and am very disappointed. As long as you don't want to customize anything, all is well. But imagine you want to install a plugin to handle Markdown editing. There the trouble begins. The plugin architecture of WordPress is seriously screwd up. In the case of Markdown, this means that no good solution exists. The existing plugin is a series of (quite well-documented) hacks that fall apart at a hard stare.
I never intended to write the least bit of code for WordPress but the last few days, I've been knee-deep in PHP the whole time, hacking plugins as well as the WordPress core in order to make it work for my special scenario (which really isn't all that special, I'm just a perfectionist). Which is a pity, because the documentation of WordPress is more than just patchy. I don't use it anymore, I grep for functions and read the source. All in all, one of the less enjoyable OpenSource projects.
You can spend hours if not days customizing Wordpress with plugins, themes, etc...
I would go with a 0 installation solution, such as blogger (https://www.blogger.com/start)
You can even use our own domain name with it if you need do.
EDIT: Plus, if you ever get slashdotted, digged or redditted, google can handle the traffic, your server probably can't.
For me, Wordpress is still the quickest & simplest to setup and get going. It can be extended to do pretty much anything or you can keep it real simple. Runs on PHP, but unless you want to write plugins for it, you never need to write code
Have a look at Blosxom. It's file-based, so no crufty database. The basic idea has been ported to different languages, pyblosxom is in Python.
I use PyBlosxom for my personal blog, and I think it is pretty useful if you need something minimalistic. The deployment is simple, as you need only the python runtime and cgi. You might want to have some basic knowledge of python at least if you are going to use it, though.
Have a look at Blosxom. It's file-based, so no crufty database. The basic idea has been ported to different languages, pyblosxom is in Python.
I wrote the engine for my personal blog in maybe 6 hours during one weekend, with comments, labels, simplified markup, sitemap, feeds and so on. It was great fun and I learned a lot of Django.
If you decide to go this way, look at generic views, this Django feature will save you much of work (and learn few useful tricks).
I Haven't tried it myself yet (other than the demo), but I've bookmarked Chyrp so that if I ever need to set up a quick & simple blog (kind of like you're describing) I could try this. So check it out, might be a good option for you.
Related
We operate a ColdFusion site with a custom CSS acting as a directory of various companies. Depending on the type of company, we have a set of subpages containing specific information pulled from the CMS about the company, such as "location/directions". We're looking to add functionality enabling users to add comments to the existing content. I'm looking for suggestions on open source or other available ColdFusion software out there that could work for this. While we could write something custom, commenting tools have been done a thousand times and probably better than we can do it.
While what we're looking for sounds like a blog or forum, its more of a hybrid. We'd like to be able to add functionality enabling commenting on the content we post in the context we post it in. Seems like there must be something out there that can be easily modified and integrated with our CMS.
Does anyone know of anything out there we should look into?
I'm going to vote to close this too, as per the others, but here's an answer anyway.
If you just want to add commenting to existing content, perhaps use Disqus. It's not locally installable (and is not CFML-based; it's all JS), but it does handle most things one would need if just wanting to add comments to a site.
If you want a native, self-managed solution, unfortunately StackOverflow have deemed that sort of question "unworthy", so you'll need to ask elsewhere. Despite being an entirely reasonable question, for which the answers would be helpful to other people later on (which is - in theory - the raison d'etre of Stack Overflow. Although that's hard to tell, sometimes).
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I am writing this to get a more realistic view of what I should be able to achieve.
I have been learning web development for just about a month now. Below are my level of proficiency on a scale of 1 to 10 (10 being not having to use google or ask a question on stackoverflow to solve all encountered issues)
Skills
Django: 5
jquery/ajax: 4.5 to 5
Html: 5
(just simple html code, having the "bone structure" of the site laid out without any fancy formatting or design)
using CSS: 0 (I think it's called css)
These are, from my understanding of the skills required to develop a site.
Am I a fast learner?
I started a month back at 0 in all categories (with limited to medium programming experience in other languages), I don't know if this counts as fast.
GOAL:
As a learning experience, I am trying to develop a news website where users subscribe to different news categories (ex: 'US news', 'Europe', 'Business'...) and they would get, in their news feed (a lot like facebook's news feed that automatically gets updated) feeds that are related to the categories they are subscribed to.
I haven't tackled website design yet; even though it is just for learning purposes, I would ultimately really like to have a nice design set up for the site, and deployed it on a server just so I would go through all the steps needed to actually launch a site.
I would really like to hear some feedback on feasibility/ get some insights on some of your personal professional experience on:
1- Hey is it feasible for a newbie to learn off the internet everything he needs to pull this off!!??
2- I am having a hard time putting a "deadline" to achieve this. How long will it take you to finish this? how long do you think it takes an almost complete novice to do this :)
Any other remarks/comments are welcome,
Thanks for sharing!!
-Rami
I think you may be over-rating your django skills a little there! I'd say someone is probably at 6/10, or 7, when they're relatively comfortable with the AOP parts of django - i.e. metaclasses, decorators, and so forth. That said, apologies if you are at this level!
I dare say what you'll find yourself doing is making the site so that it works - this won't take long at all - and then doing a ~huge re-write using more sophisticated code. And so on.
Another issue you may have with a dynamic site like this is database optimizations and, though not really applicable for a feeds-based site, caching. I'm currently working on doing optimizations on a large website, where the initial programmer didn't care about efficiency so long as it worked. So it became incredibly inefficient, some pages using 1000+ queries (though not bad code, at all, really) - some model methods potentially doing 50k+ queries (ouch!). Most optimizations were fairly trivial (select_related, annotate, aggregate, update, etc) - some were outside of the ORM's scope and required raw SQL and/or efficient c-based algorithms. The latter have sped some pages up from ~700queries/7seconds to 3queries in 0.4seconds - impossible to do in just django.
All in all, how long it'll take to make the website depends on your audience. If its for <100 users, then it won't take you long at all (apart from the design, I could spend years playing with css and my site would still look ugly) - if its intended for a much larger user-base, then you could be spending a lot longer on it... in my opinion!
1- Hey is it feasible for a newbie to
learn everything he needs of the
internet and pull this off!!??
Completely! The information is all there. Django is an extremely well documented framework. You might have to use the brain for specific actions but most of it already exists in the framework or by using plugins. The rest you already know. As for the CSS part, get a theme from some online site and adapt it to your needs. Keep backups to revert to in case you destroy something.
2- I am having a hard time putting a
"deadline" to achieve this. How long
will it take you to finish this? how
long do you think it takes an almost
complete novice to do this :)
Can't help you there.. No one works the same way and that will be based on your experience, knowledge, background and so on. Start doing it and adapt as you go.
Good luck!
Background:
I have a new site in the design phase and am considering using ColdFusion. The Server is currently set-up with ColdFusion and Python (done for me).
It is my choice on what to use and ColdFusion seems intriguing with the tag concept. Having developed sites in PHP and Python the idea of using a new tool seems fun but I want to make sure it is as easy to use as my other two choices with things like URL beautification and scalability.
Are there any common problems with using ColdFusion in regards to scalability and speed of development?
My other choice is to use Python with WebPy or Django.
ColdFusion 9 with a good framework like Sean Cornfeld's FW/1 has plenty of performance and all the functionality of any modern web server development language. It has some great integration features like exchange server support and excel / pdf support out of the box.
Like all tools it may or may not be the right one for you but the gotchas in terms of scalability will usually be with your code, rarely the platform.
Liberally use memcached or the built in ehache in CF9, be smart about your data access strategy, intelligently chunk returned data and you will be fine performance wise.
My approach with CF lately involves using jQuery extensively for client side logic and using CF for the initial page setup and ajax calls to fill tables. That dramatically cuts down on CF specific code and forces nice logic separation. Plus it cuts the dependency on any one platform (aside from the excellent jQuery library).
To specifically answer your question, if you read the [coldfusion] tags here you will see questions are rarely on speed or scalability, it scales fine. A lot of the questions seem to be on places where CF is a fairly thin layer on another tool like Apache Axis (web services) and ExtJs (cfajax) - neither of which you need to use. You will probably need mod-rewrite or IIS rewrite to hide .cfm
Since you have both ColdFusion and Python available to you already, I would carefully consider exactly what it is you're trying to accomplish.
Do you need a gradual learning curve, newbie-friendly language (easy for someone who knows HTML to learn), great documentation, and lots of features that make normally difficult tasks easy? That sounds like a job for ColdFusion.
That said, once you get the basics of ColdFusion down, it's easy to transition into an Object Oriented approach (as others have noted, there are a plethora of MVC frameworks available: FW/1, ColdBox, Fusebox, Model-Glue, Mach-ii, Lightfront, and the list goes on...), and there are also dependency management (DI/IoC) frameworks (my favorite of which is ColdSpring, modeled after Java's Spring framework), and the ability to do Aspect-Oriented Programming, as well. Lastly, there are also several ORM frameworks (Transfer, Reactor, and DataFaucet, if you're using CF8 or earlier, or add Hibernate to the list in CF9+).
ColdFusion also plays nicely with just about everything else out there. It can load and use .Net assemblies, provides native access to Java classes, and makes creating and/or consuming web services (particularly SOAP, but REST is possible) a piece of cake. (I think it even does com/corba, if you feel like using tech from 1991...)
Unfortunately, I've got no experience with Python, so I can't speak to its strengths. Perhaps a Python developer can shed some light there.
As for url rewrting, (again, as others have noted) that's not really done in the language (though you can fudge it); to get a really nice looking URL you really need either mod_rewrite (which can be done without .htaccess, instead the rules would go into your Apache VHosts config file), or with one of the IIS URL Rewriting products.
The "fudging" I alluded to would be a url like: http://example.com/index.cfm/section/action/?search=foo -- the ".cfm" is in the URL so that the request gets handed from the web server (Apache/IIS) to the Application Server (ColdFusion). To get rid of the ".cfm" in the URL, you really do have to use a URL rewriting tool; there's no way around it.
From two years working with CF, for me the biggest gotchas are:
If you're mainly coding using tags (rather than CFScript) and formatting for readability, be prepared for your output to be filled with whitespace. Unlike other scripting languages, the whitespace between statements are actually sent to the client - so if you're looping over something 100 times and outputting the result, all the linebreaks and tabs in the loop source code will appear 100 times. There are ways around this but it's been a while - I'm sure someone on SO has asked the question before, so a quick search will give you your solution.
Related to the whitespace problem, if you're writing a script to be used with AJAX or Flash and you're trying to send xml; even a single space before the DTD can break some of the more fussy parsing engines (jQuery used to fall over like this - I don't know if it still does and flash was a nightmare). When I first did this I spent hours trying to figure out why what looked like well formed XML was causing my script to die.
The later versions aren't so bad, but I was also working on legacy systems where even quite basic functionality was lacking. Quite often you'll find you need to go hunting for a COM or Java library to do the job for you. Again, though, this is in the earlier versions.
CFAJAX was a heavy, cumbersome beast last time I checked - so don't bother, roll your own.
Other than that, I found CF to be a fun language to work with - it has its idiosyncracies like everything else, but by and large it was mostly headache free and fast to work with.
Hope this helps :)
Cheers
Iain
EDIT: Oh, and for reasons best known to Adobe, if you're running the trial version you'll get a lovely fat HTML comment before all of your output - regardless of whether or not you're actually outputting HTML. And yes, because the comment appears before your DTD, be prepared for some browsers (not looking at any one in particular!) to render it like crap. Again - perhaps they've rethought this in the new version...
EDIT#2: You also mentioned URL Rewriting - where I used to work we did this all the time - no problems. If you're running on Apache, use mod_rewrite, if you're running on IIS buy ISAPI Rewrite 3.
do yourself the favor and check out the CFWheels project. it has the url rewriting support and routes that you're looking for. also as a full stack mvc framework, it comes with it's own orm.
It's been a few years, so my information may be a little out of date, but in my experience:
Pros:
Coldfusion is easy to learn, and quick to get something up and running end-to-end.
Cons:
As with many server-side scripting languages, there is no real separation between persistence logic, business logic, and presentation. All of these are typically interwoven throughout a typical Coldfusion source file. This can mean a lot more work if you want to make changes to the database schema of a mature application, for example.
There are some disciplines that can be followed to make things a little more maintainable; "Fusebox" was one. There may be others.
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I'm pretty handy with django and python but I'm terrible at the "visual" aspect of the web-design. Even after quite a bit of google-ing I haven't been able to find any sort of resource that has download-able templates complete with css, images, etc. that could be used to set up a basic website easily.
I'm looking for examples beyond the 5-line examples that you find in most tutorials ... I'm looking for something with the general nav-bar across the top, various content-blocks to over-ride through subclassing, footers, etc.
I've worked with others on django projects but always on the "coding side". I want to do my own project. I've set up all of the views, models, "business logic", I just cant get off the ground with the design section.
Any help would be appreciated.
Edit: Just to be a little more clear. I'm looking for designs (open licensed) ... akin to Wordpress themes. If you have a resource of just themes I can probably mung them into a django template but if you know of something that already provides them as templates I'd prefer that.
I've had some luck in the past with sites like OpenDesigns and FreeCSSTemplates -- they offer (mostly) CC-licensed HTML templates; you'll have to add the Django template stuff yourself. As James pointed out though, most of them will get you up and running, but you almost always want to take things a step further.
My advice: build up a small library of re-usable templates (using stuff from the above sites), get real comfortable editing HTML and CSS (because you will edit HTML and CSS), then find some kickass designers (preferably local) and get real friendly with them. Perhaps you can trade favors; you do some coding work for them, for free, and in return they do some design work for you. I've found that even if you have to pay, a good designer is well worth the money (seriously, who wants to spend their time testing sites in IE6?).
Good luck with your search though -- I, for one, would love to see your findings.
It seems like this is an area that is completely lacking. I've been looking for a django project, perhaps a meta-django project is a good way to go ;).
Maybe if designers could upload a set of templates against a simple and well defined set of models. They could upload a "main.html", "object_list.html", "object_detail.html", a css file and a few images. This would be something akin to the CSS Zen Garden project.
I've setup a github repository here: http://github.com/JudoWill/DjangoTemplateRepository. Feel free to log into the project and modify the wiki with requests.
The idea being to give newbies a starting point and a few examples for making their django website.
I suspect this has got nothing to do with django templates, your question sounds more of a design and markup. There are couple of css framework like Blueprint, 960, YAML.
I don't think you're going to be able to find what you're looking for unfortunately - I have the same problem.
Wordpress templates can assume a fairly well-known data model - every Wordpress installation uses the same predictable table names, every (say) blog page has a well-defined set of data that will be passed to the template - and even the plugins have only a limited number of plugin points to add extra data.
By contrast, your Django app could contain anything. I could provide you a pretty template, but unless the data I use in the template exactly matches your data model, it's not going to be useful. I could make the template very very generic - eg, just have it display the variable called 'form' if it's present, iterate over 'messages' if any are present at the top of the page, display a 'footer' at the bottom etc - but it will take you about 20 seconds before you want to customise the display of that form, and then you're back editing your own templates.
I think that the closest thing you're going to find are UI libraries like jQuery or YUI which can handle a lot of the work of making your UI look snazzy.
I'd like to be proven wrong though, it would save me going through the same trial as you're going through now.
Update: On re-reading this, it occurred to me that you're looking for a CMS, which Django is not. Two seconds of work with Google revealed django CMS. I haven't tried it, but maybe that's closer to what you're looking for? The django wiki has a comparison table of various django-based CMS solutions
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What features should "Tomorrow's" wikis include? How might they incorporate Web 2.0 features like AJAX? What other features are they currently missing? What do you want to see from the next release of your favorite Wiki?
Edit: How might a Wiki be integrated into other products? What "neat uses" could wikis have?
Preview-as-you-type works very nicely indeed here on Stack Overflow. Many wikis don't do that.
Make it really easy to link between pages, eg. that, as you type, the wiki finds likely pages you may be referring to. That way you can make links without having to know the exact title of a target page, and bouncing on the shift key to WriteInCamelCase, or throwing in square brackets. Make it very easy to link to other websites outside the wiki, too (and by "easy" I do not mean like wikisisters, which, if I remember correctly, is like foowiki:ALinkLikeThis).
Similarly, if you can generate links within text automatically, you could, for example, have a mail system that wikifies your email. You create a wiki page, say, for Joel Spolsky, and references to Joel emails in your inbox become links to that page, which you can find by clicking "what links here". (This probably needs something along the lines of Bayesian filtering to prune the stray references to other Joels... your Bayesian Classifier learns that if the context is smart and getting things done, it's Spolsky. If it's flying Viking kittens, it's morely likely Joel Veich).
A variety of RSS feeds for tracking changes would nice, too. (Diffs, full text, changes on pages I've edited, ...)
Wikipedia has grown a fairly colossal categorisation system ("Fictional Cats", anyone?); laying a taxonomy over a wiki's flat namespace could provide another way for users to find their way around. Wikipedia's doing this a little, but in fairly limited ways so far: there are links to the relevant category lists, but you can't, for example, look for a composer called "Smith".
Similarly, wikis give you this big graph of interconnected nodes, of how closely your community sees the relevant concepts as being. Is that interesting? Is that useful? Does anyone who isn't google want to think about this stuff?
PS. If you believe Paul Graham's definition of Web 2.0 as "Democracy, Don't Maltreat Users, and Javascript works now", wikis are two thirds Web 2.0 already.
I am personally already tired of wikis. Wiki as a software is outdated, now it is about wiki as a feature (like my favorite new website, stack overflow).
The main advantage of community wiki — more editing — came into existence when we introduced "Suggested Edits".
With "Suggested Edits", anyone, even an anonymous user, can edit anything — so long as another experienced user reviews and approves their edit.
I'm in the process of choosing a wiki tool, and have looked at numerous packages over the past week. I'm sure there are dozens I haven't even heard of yet, probably good ones. But in general, here's my "beginner's mind" take on the problem.
Wiki markup should be abandoned. A wiki that is limited to wiki markup will only be useful to 'nix hacks and others who get excited about doing things the hard way and insisting that everybody else is stupid. I mean, Morse code is fine with me personally; I don't get what was wrong with a nice, clean dash-dot-dash. Or smoke signals, they were nice, except for the carbon footprint. But times change, and we have to change with them.
Real users (business users, customers, clients) want rich text editing. Period. And when a wiki tries to support both rich text and wiki markup, the results are not pretty. The model is confusing and (apparently) difficult to implement. The fckeditor extension at wikiwiki is a nightmare, for example. It's just not worth it.
Wikis need better access control. The idea that all content should be open to everyone is fine for an open, public, non-profit wiki like this one. But in the business world, that's not how it works. Restricting access is not evil, it's reality. Wiki tools need to do a much better job of providing access control: access to pages and groups of pages based on role or group membership, where groups can be formed by anyone on an ad hoc basis and users can belong to multiple groups and pages can be accessible to multiple groups, at the whim of the page's creator.
Those are the two things that I want, above all else, and I haven't found it in open source, at least not out of the box. Which, of course, is why open source is open source.
There's been some interesting work using wikis for testing and software development. EG, movement towards literate programming -- allowing pages to exist as both code and documentation that is compiled down into one or the other (or, I suppose, both simultaneously).
They have a regular session about this at the annual WikiSym conference.
I think one direction of Wikis is going from open ended collections of documents to an "everyone can edit but with more structure" applications like SO.
Another direction that I've seen is more direct integration with other project support tools, so project planning, issue management, and all that stuff.
Personally, I think the next big direction is going to be some sort of multimedia based Wiki, not just a Wiki where multimedia can be embedded in the text.
I really like MediaWiki. It's widely used and free/Free. The markup syntax is straightforward and allows you to do enough basic styling that you don't need to use custom HTML or to use a WYSIWYG. I assume by "sexy web 2.0" you mean Flash/AJAX, but I like MediaWiki because it works cleanly with basic HTML/Javascript (you don't have to wait for custom widgets to load, etc...).
What makes wikis reach their potential of usefulness is the community that develops around them more than the software itself. You need to find a niche where people are both passionate about (but not criminally insane about) the central topic and have enough technical prowess to log on to a website and edit some text.
"Wiki" is ultimately just a pattern:
Open editing by all/most visitors
Integrated revision tracking and rollback to reduce the cost of mistakes
Simple syntax for cross-linking between articles, and auto-creation of stub articles when referenced
That's not a perfect description, but it's a combination that isn't particularly magic. Successful wikis combine those things with a critical mass of people creating and maintaining content.
The next step, IMO, is less about web 2.0 shininess and more about the integration of better structural information. Adding any metadata beyond "this points to that" is an exercise in brute force hand-markup. Maybe microformats? Maybe the development of more structured knowledgebase software that uses wiki-ish editing UI but a smarter backend? I'm not sure, but I think better handling of the structured data is really the next wave.
Extensibility.
Check out DekiWiki, they are doing an excellent job with this.
DekiWiki extensions
The wiki-of-the-future will be completely editable online, concurrently by everyone. Check out EtherPad for a demo of the techonology.
For me, in terms of Enterprise style uses for a wiki, I have a couple of thoughts;
An effective way to keep and synchronise a central, web based wiki with multiple, offline, desktop style wiki's for people on the go
To move towards wiki as a function as opposed to wiki as a system, so we can integrate the wiki collaborative system into other things