I'm all for language diversity, but Objective C is insane. So I'm curious: is it possible to code iPhone apps with C++ while using the Cocoa API, etc?
Although Objective-C does indeed appear to be "insane" initially, I encourage you to stick with it. Once you have an "a-ha" moment, suddenly it all starts to make sense. For me it took about 2 weeks of focused Objective-C concentration to really understand the Cocoa frameworks, the language, and how it all fits together. But once I really "got" it, it was very very exciting.
It sounds cliché, but it's true. Stick it out.
Of course, if you're bringing in C++ libraries or existing C++ code, you can use those modules with Objective-C/Objective-C++.
Short answer, yes, sort of. You can use Objective-C++, which you can read about at Apple Developer Connection.
If you know C++ already, learning Objective-C would be pretty simple, if you decided to give that a try. More info on that topic is at the ADC as well.
I use Objective-C to slap the UI together.
But the hard guts of the code is still written in C++.
That is the main purpose of Objective-C the UI interface and handling the events.
And it works great for that purpose.
I still like C++ as the backend for the code though (but that's mainly becuase I like C++) you could quite easily use Objective-C for the backend of the application as well.
First off, saying Objective-C is "insane" is humorous- I have the Bjarne Stroustrup C++ book sitting by my side which clocks in at 1020 pages. Apple's PDF on Objective-C is 141.
If you want to use UIKit it will be very, very difficult for you to do anything in C++. Any serious iPhone app that conforms to Apple's UI will need it's UI portions to be written in Objective-C. Only if you're writing an OpenGL game can you stick almost entirely to C/C++.
Having some experience of this, you can indeed use C++ code for your "core" code, but you have to use objective-C for anything iPhone specific.
Don't try to force Objective-C to act like C++. At first it will seem to you this is possible, but the resulting code really won't work well with Cocoa, and you will get very confused as to what is going on. Take the time to learn properly, without any C++ around, how to build GUIs and iPhone applications, then link in your C++ base.
You have to use Objective C to interface with the Cocoa API, so there is no choice. Of course, you can use as much C++ as you like behind the scenes (Objective C++ makes this easy).
It is an insane language indeed, but it's also... kind of fun to use once you're a bit used to it. :-)
I'm not sure about C++, but you can definitely code iPhone applications in C#, using a product called MonoTouch.
You can see this post for detailed discussion on MonoTouch Vs Obj-C: How to decide between MonoTouch and Objective-C?
I'm in the process of porting a computation-intensive Android app written in Java to iOS6. I'm doing this by porting the non-UI parts from Java to C++, writing the (minimal) UI parts in Obj-C, and wrapping the former in a (small) C interface using the standard C/C++ technique, so that it can be accessed from Obj-C, which is after all a superset of C.
This has been effective so far, and I haven't encountered any gotchas. It seems to be a legitimate approach, since Xcode lets you create C++ classes as well as Obj-C classes, and some of the official sample code does things this way. I haven't had to go outside any officially supported interfaces to do this.
There wouldn't seem to be much to gain from writing my remaining UI code in C++ even if it were possible, in view of the help given to you by the interface builder in Xcode, so my answer would be that you can use C++ for almost all your app, or as much of it as you find appropriate/convenient.
Yes but Thinking that you can program every kind of program in a single language is a flawed idea unless you are writing very simple programs. Objective C is for Cocoa as C# is for .NET, Use the right tool for right job, Trying to make C++ interact to Cocoa via writing bridging code and trying to make C++ code behave according to Cocoa requirements is not a good idea neither expecting C++ performance from Objective C is. You should try to layout design and architecture of app keeping in view existing skills and determine which part should be written in which language then build accordingly.
I'm currently writing an Objective-C++ framework called Objective-X, wich makes PURE C++ iPHONE PROGRAMMING possible. You can do like this:
#import "ObjectiveX.h"
void GUIApplicationMain() {
GUIAlert Alert;
GUILabel Label;
GUIScreen MainScreen;
Alert.set_text(#"Just a lovely alert box!");
Alert.set_title(#"Hello!");
Alert.set_button(#"Okay");
Alert.show();
Label.set_text(#"Ciao!");
Label.set_position(100, 200, 120, 40);
MainScreen.init();
MainScreen.addGUIControl(Label.init());
}
and compile it using GCC's appropriate commandline options. I've already compiled this helloworld app&it w0rkX0rz like a charm. ;-) It'll available soon on GoogleCode. Search for Objective-X or visit http://infotronix.orgfree.com/objectivex approx. a week later!
Updated (but apparently inactive) URL: http://code.google.com/p/objectivex/
It may be a bit offtopic, but anyway. You can program c++ right on iOS devices. Check out CppCode ios app - http://cppcode.info. I believe it helps to learn c and c++ and objective-c later.
Related
is there anything similar to unity but with the difference that instead of javascript I can use C++?
It is funny, I was looking to learn a little bit of unity as I seen it as requirement for some postings... and I found this question.
I think Ogre3D is great... it may be what you are looking for.
here is the link ogre3d.org
Ogre3D is what I used. http://www.ogre3d.org/
It is somewhat of a misconception that Unity uses Javascript. The so-called Javascript used in Unity is actually a dialect of Javascript that is CLI-compatible and is not exactly the same as the official Javascript. Also, you are not limited to using Javascript in Unity. You can also use C#, which is similar to C++ and Java in some ways or the less commonly used Boo script.
Personally, I would recommend using C# in Unity because it is very powerful and allows calling of native C/C++ functions via P/Invoke. Here is a link to the use of plugins:
http://unity3d.com/support/documentation/Manual/Plugins.html
Link to list of Game Engines. Please take your time to read and consider them:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_game_engines
If you want accessibility offered by Unity, C++ is certainly wrong choice. Much better would be interpreted/script language, such as Python. They are more flexible in terms of working in web browser/many os-es.
If you're interested in targetting mobile platforms then Marmalade might be a good fit.
Panda3D It's not a think compared to Unity, but it can work as a web plugin, cross-platform. It has a lack of IDE, but it is opensource.
As far as I know, there is no need to use JavaScript or Boo with Unity, and there is nothing wrong with C# acting like script language ( which is really hard with C++ ).
as a unity developer, I liked to add c++ to by knowledge base as all AAA games are made by C++ and I was looking for something like unity but for CPP. the only good cpp engine is unreal that doesn't really support c++. the language is a dialect of c++ and there are big differences. like very
rare usages of pointer and references
more syntaxes like c# attributes(cpp has not attribute)
...
so you don't learn memory management. the nearest thing that I could find was COCOS2dx as the whole framework is written in pure standard c++ and many libraries like UI and Physics are already added. you can write your own engine and editor with it.
Unreal Engine uses C++
default standard is C++14
https://www.unrealengine.com
I recently started C++. I am using PHP right now and decided to take a look at C++. Web programming had me working with a couple of languages, with a couple of people. I wanted to do programming where I only had to bother with one language and create small utility apps (mostly not web-based). I wanted a compiled, strongly-type language without memorizing a tome of classes. Basically I wanted to learn C++ for the following:
mobile programming (I don't ever want to go touching Java, and I don't have a Mac for Objective C or IPhone SDK)
small desktop apps like DTRs, POSs
creating small desktop-based games
creating small Air-like applications that can access the web for additional content
I heard that C++ is not beginner-friendly and is mostly used for huge projects with lots of calculations and fine details (like 3D games). Is it practical or even possible for me to use C++ for the above cases? (Sorry, I haven't delved on C++ that much yet, so aside from "huge, monolithic project", I don't know any other uses for it)
You can certainly use C++ in all the areas you mention, though whether it is best of breed for any of them is open to debate. C++ is very large and complex language, and requires a fair bit of effort to get up to speed on. If I were you, I would pick one of the areas you mention that you are most interested in, and then find out which language(s) are best suited for that area and learn that.
If you are set on learning C++ you will need to read at least one book on it - you cannot learn it from internet resources alone. See this question The Definitive C++ Book Guide and List for a book list.
On the droid you can use other languages aside from Java - check out their ASE (Active Scripting Environment). C++ / C should really only be used when you have no other choice - i.e. speed critical code, operating systems etc. It's very easy to make a mistake that's difficult to diagnose and there are lots of task where it'll take way longer than it should to write and odds are others have already done so and done it way better - reinventing the wheel is bad. If it interests you though by all means learn and eventually you may master it. It's an excellent skill to have.
It's also not a completely object oriented language however, it's a hybrid one that supports most object oriented features, but some such as inheritance and polymorphism are a bit awkward to deal with in C++ - for example you have to define methods as virtual in base classes in order to be allowed to redefine them in subclasses - sort of like predicting the future - will this method every be desired to be redefined by an inheritor? Really what happens in that case is you make the base class method virtual later on to enable it to be redefinable - that is if you happen to have access to the source code to do just that - if not then oh well. For an example of this confusing stuff in C++ and other gotchas: Pitfalls
Look at other languages such as Ruby or Python - in particular Stackless Python where a combination of it and C++ (used where necessary) was used to create EVE Online as well as the functional languages such Erlang and Haskell.
For 2, 3 and 4, I recommend C# over C++, for the reasons I wrote here.
About 1, you can do iPhone development with .NET but I've never tried it and I don't know how viable it is.
Edit
To answer your actual question: yes, it's totally practical to write small and large desktop apps in C++. Especially if you use quality tools like Visual Studio and Qt. It's just that I think it'd waste a lot of your time for no reason, unless you intend to go into professional game development eventually.
I went to C++ from PHP like you, but I was more interested in 3D games and such. Now I have moved on to C# and find it much more enjoyable than C++.
As for your specific areas of interest however, C++ is certainly an option but C# may be better.
Mobile programming with C++ is probably not a good idea. I know it's possible with NDKs and such but for a beginner it's probably not so good. For iPhone development, other than the official SDK, the next best option is the (commercial) MonoTouch framework from Novell. However, you may still need a mac to deploy (I don't know). In terms of Android, if you don't want to touch Java (don't blame you) I believe a C# framework (similar to MonoTouch) is in development and other languages may be available. Other platforms? No idea.
Small desktop apps is also very possible with C++. Assuming you're running Windows, you can use the Win32 API (pain) or the C++/CLI API (better). You could also use a different GUI framework like Qt, wxWidgets or GTK+ which are all also supported on other platforms. Again coming back to C#, GUI development using GTK# in MonoDevelop is so much fun. Having used WinForms in Visual C# Express back in my Windows days, I can say that I now enjoy the process whereas I didn't before.
Games are my main area of interest and the reason I originally picked up C++. Seeing as you've said small and desktop-based, using C++ for performance reasons is way overkill IMO. You could make a decent, fun, playable game in Python using pygame without the pain of using a language like C++. In C# (yes, I'm trying to sell it to you) you could create awesome games using the XNA framework from Microsoft or other frameworks like (my personal favorite) OpenTK.
Rich internet applications. C++ is probably not the right tool to use here. It's certainly possible but seeing as C++ has no standard networking library, you would have to figure some of this stuff out yourself. C# may not be the right tool either but it makes it a little easier. There are other options as well (like Python) but it's not something I know much about.
Despite what I've said about it, I still think C++ is a good language to learn. It teaches you about lower-level things you never think about in PHP land. If you want to learn it, the book that really helped me was "C++: A beginners guide" by Herbert Schildt and also "Programming" by Bjarne Stroustrup.
Yes, your use cases can all be done with C++, more or less (YMMV on mobile devices).
To some degree or another, a language like C# will be more rapid to develop in, however.
In my opinion, once you get away from the straight-up form design features and hack for a while in a language & application, language feature comparisons begin to diminish in meaningfulness.
I recommend C++ as a first "heavyweight" language; see here for my most recent discussion on it.
I've been coding on C++/Linux for 10+ years.
I am switching to do Mac development.
My development involves GUI components.
Is my only choice to learn Cocoa/Objective-C, or is there a way to wrap Cocoa and use it from C++ land?
Thanks!
Yes, you need to learn Objective-C. Besides, you wouldn't gain much if you didn't need to. It's not the language that's hard to learn but the Cocoa framework (not because it's inherently hard but because it's so huge).
You could use Carbon, but that's deprecated.
As Ole says, Objective-C is not hard to learn if you have a C++ background - and you can mix the languages if you use Objective-C++ (which can be useful, but usually best to partition the code that uses different languages - so use Objective-C/ Cocoa for the GUI layer and C++ for the core logic. I do it this way in my iPhone game, vConqr).
If you've done GUI work in C++ I think you'll appreciate why Objective-C was chosen for Cocoa. It's very nice for event driven designs and has a number of abstractions that are a natural fit. As you get into more abstract areas, though, especially if you use a lot of containers and algorithms, you'll probably start to find the limitations a little annoying. But give it time - there are other useful abstractions that are not immediately obvious (dynamic typing, key/ value coding and other forms of reflection, categories...).
You might also find this stackoverflow question useful.
No, I don't think you need to learn Objective-C. You can use Qt framework to develop applications on Mac using C++.
If you are only going to work on Mac apps, then learn Objective-C and the Cocoa frameworks. Cocoa apps can pick up new features "for free" in newer Mac OS X releases, and will be more future-proof than a cross-platform app framework like Qt.
There are so many aspects to Cocoa frameworks (collectively) that you would be best served by sticking to the native app framework to serve your customers (end users). That is really what matters, not the short term inconvenience of learning a new language or framework (which comes with the job, adapt or die).
Pretty soon you will be as frustrated with Xcode as the rest of us.
I use WxWindows on the Mac for my tool development. Took a little bit of working but I got my Jam based c++ pipeline that I use on windows working perfectly. The only thing you need to remember to get it all correctly working is to create the proper application rules... easy to get working as a jam rule.
As mentioned in a few of the other answers, there are a number of cross platform GUI libraries that support mac. Such as Qt and WxWindows. You can use any of them, I personally have only used Qt and found it quite pleasurable to work with after coming from Java and C toolkits.
In order to use the native GUI libraries, you can use Python as well (PyObjC). Java is also able to make native looking apps in OS X.
I would like to create a portable library for iPhone, that also could be used for other platforms.
My question is the fallowing:
Does anyone knows what is the best to be used on the iPhone: Objective-C or Objective-C++? Does it works with C++ the same way as Objective-C with C or not?
Reasons: Objective-C is a superset of C, but Objective-C++ is not a superset of C++.
Thanks in advance!
UPDATE: What about memory usage, speed in the same implementation of an use case?
UPDATE1: If anyone can provide any more information, he'll be welcome.
If you're writing a portable library, and don't need specific language features for it, why not write it in straight C? It can be easily called from C++, C, Objective-C, and many, many other languages.
If you require specific language features that aren't available in C, you should tell us what they are so you can get better advice =)
I believe your information is incorrect. Objective-C++ is a superset of C++. Any C++ is legal Objective-C++. In addition, you can mix Objective-C and C++ code in an Objective-C++ (usually .mm) file and (with some restrictions) mix Objective-C and C++ class instance variables within an Objective-C++ class. Objective-C++ is particularly useful for interfacing between Objective-C and a C++ library. Write your cross-platform library in C++. You can then call it from Objective-C++ within an application. Re-read the Objective-C++ section of the Objective-C language guide for more info.
The major downside to using Objective-C++ is increased compile times (Objective-C++ is even worse than C++ and the Clang LLVM compiler doesn't handle Objective-C++ yet). There is no performance difference between Objective-C and Objective-C++ beyond any differences in the code that's called (e.g. if you're a better C++ dev., your C++ will probably be more efficient than your C library and visa versa).
They're not really different languages. Objective-C++ is just Objective-C with slightly limited support for including C++ code. Objective-C is the standard dialect, but if you need to work with C++, there's no reason not to use it. AFAIK, the biggest practical difference (aside from allowing use of different libraries) is that Objective-C++ seems to compile a bit slower. Just be sure to read up on it first if you do decide to go that route, because the merging of C++ and Objective-C is not 100% seamless.
If you are going to use this library on platforms other than the iPhone and Mac OS, you should use C++. If you plan only to port it to Mac OS, then go ahead and use Objective-C. Objective-C++ is just a way to integrate existing C++ code into Objective-C projects. Thus, you would not write a library in it. You might, however, use Objective-C++ to use this library from an iPhone or Mac project.
The truth is you can use C or C++ in Xcode. The reason to use Objective C for Cocoa and Cocoa Touch (iphone) is because of it's ease of use and how it handles many of the memory issues you would come across on it's own. Objective C and Xcode work like a dream. I would also recommend checking out http://www.kevincallahan.org/software/accessorizer.html
Accessorizer is amazing and cuts development time into nothing.
Having said that I see no problem in writing functions/methods in C or C++ and using them within a part of your XCode project. Just do not expect to use Objective C to play as nicely on other platforms. Apple and Windows development IDE's are different and Microsoft has a nice habit for not making things as compatible with other environments (not just Apple.)
I am glad to hear someone out their trying to reuse their code for other projects : ) Too many people forget to create their own libraries these days and I haven't the slightest idea why.
I hope this helps. Cheers,
Matthew
Here is your caveat: Spend the hundred on becoming a developer and launch xcode the IDE you will be working with on the Mac - this would be the best way for you to decide as it is apparent that you do not fully understand how this platform works at all.
Please don't be rude to everyone trying to help you. This community is built on respect. The people here really actually do help out and care and there are few places like this on the net left.
Go for C or C++ - I do not see any reason for recommending one over the other without knowing more about your goals.
In terms of memory usage, C++ and C do demand more disciplined coding. In terms of speed, C and C++ will in virtually any case be faster than any ObjC/ObjC++ solution. I do frequently mix my Objective C applications with C and C++ code and was always pleased with the results. As Jonathan correctly stated, ObjectiveC++ is mostly a bridge for using C++ code/libraries within your Objective C application/s.
You can freely use C++ objects from within Objective C++. You can however NOT use Objective C/C++ objects within C++. So its a one-way-road. To overcome any limitations imposed by this restriction, simply wrap your C++ objects with Objective C++ classes where needed.
"Objective-C is a strict superset of C, and Objective-C++ is a strict superset of C++." - https://developer.apple.com/library/mac/documentation/DeveloperTools/Conceptual/CppRuntimeEnv/Articles/SymbolVisibility.html
Sorry if this is mentioned somewhere, couldn't find any info about it. Post a comment if you find a duplicate.
This is not about whether it's possible at all to compile a C++ program for the iPhone (which I suppose is possible).
Basically the question is, can you bridge between Objective C and C++?, and if it is possible, would it be feasible to wrap the entire Cocoa Touch API for iPhone with a nice C++ library?
I know nothing about Objective C, and I would really like the idea of bringing my current skills in C++ to the iPhone.
EDIT: Very similar question here
This question is very close to duplicating your own.
However, I would suggest spending a little more time with Objective-C. I had done C++ development myself before learning Objective-C, and it was a pretty smooth transition. Many of the core concepts are the same, and all of your base C skills will translate across. I think that once you get a little ways into it, you'll find that direct Objective-C interaction with the Cocoa frameworks is really the way to go on the Mac and iPhone. There are many great resources for getting started, like the ones I list here.
Admittedly, there are some cases where it's preferred to have a cross-platform C++ engine behind the scenes, and an Objective-C / Cocoa UI.